A CHURCH A BUILDING OR THE PEOPLE

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by nic paton on November 11, 2009 at 2:40am

Howard, my very short answer is that the root word "ekklesia" means a gathering of citizens, or a gathering of the called out ones. It certainly did not mean a building.

It's a great question, and I hope other people get involved. I'm happy to discuss it further, but I'd like to pose a question to you: Is it possible to see the people of God as a "tribe"?

I've got some thoughts on this (and it will include your question to some extent), on my post called Ecclesia as Sacred Tribe.

Permalink Reply by Howard Ngwira on November 11, 2009 at 10:52am

Hello Nic Paton,
I will reserve much comment because perhaps others within the missionary Community formation Network may have different views. Your question on: Is it possible to see the people of God as a tribe? Here is my comment, Yes, in another way because if we view the Church as a family it is similar to a tribe but in this again much thoughts have to be put in because normally a tribe consist of people of one large but different families just as the church is one body but different members. To me, I have never thought to see the people of God as a tribe. God called his people of Israel in the wilderness as a Congregation (it was a tribe). So literally, in another way the people of God may or may not be seen as a tribe.

Permalink Reply by Andrew Hendrikse on November 12, 2009 at 3:56pm

Hi Howard, sorry for the late response....

Our community of believers meet in the homes of our group. We have never met inside a traditional style of church building. The early church of believers was simply that. I'm not sure exactly when Christians started to build churches, but what a waste of resources that had been over the last 2000 years.

Permalink Reply by Timothy Victor on November 18, 2009 at 8:19am

I'm not sure that an either/or dichotomy is helpful.

The act, location, model and people meeting are all together "church" when they do so in order to connect with and worship God. The only place its helpful to differentiate is when "God" is taken out of the picture or when the community replaces God with something else.

In that case we have a "gathering" but not a "gathering with/before God". In Scripture we have everything from a nation strongly defined by location and professional involvement through to a rag-tag scattered group of outcast individuals all considered the "people of God". Let's embrace a similar diversity today.

Permalink Reply by Howard Ngwira on November 18, 2009 at 11:50am

Thank brother Timothy. Perhaps in God's will and time we shall meet. Infact people have a mind coceipt of a place we meet as a Church but in reality, the Word Church means a group of people gathered together. The people of God gathered together form a Church, a Building, Family, Body of Christ, Temple of God, Habitant of God etc. Perhaps should God grant us an opportunity to meet we will share more with each other. I thank you for your insight.
Beloved, if the people of God can understand that they are the church, the term of Going to Church or attending church will not be there. Thanks and let us keep in touch

Permalink Reply by Timothy Victor on November 18, 2009 at 12:22pm

It sounds to me like your creating a dichotomy between the people and the place. Theologically everyone will argue that temple=people and not place.I don't know a single person who would say that the church = the building. Creating a false dichotomy is unnecessary.

The people can gather but if they don't gather for and with God then what's the point? If the people gather for and with God, what does it matter whether they use a house, a park or club together for a facility?

Permalink Reply by nic paton on November 21, 2009 at 4:09am

Howard, I think you main point is been well made: that "going to church" has too narrowly defined the concept to mean a place.

In my thought, there are 4 understandings of "temple"
1) Temple is a place.
2) Temple is the person (you are the temple of the Holy Spirit)
3) Temple is the people (as you say "if the people of God can understand that they are the church")
4) Temple is praise : As in God being present in the praises of the people.

All have a place, but spiritual growth generally means we shall start at 1 and move towards 4.

See a fuller idea in my post 4 Temples.

Permalink Reply by Howard Ngwira on November 21, 2009 at 12:10pm

Nic. this is very true and I now feel very free in my heart to welconme you as our brother indeed. Two people can not walk together unless they agree. The so called church has a wrong concept about the Word "Church" refering to a building. Never was itrefered to as a so called building. Each time a building was refered to as a temple, tebernacle or synagogue.

Beloved brother Nic, I desire to spent time with you and the Saints there, I see the Father has installed much that would help us here. What do you think?
I will try to send photos as we shall gather tomorrow.